Personal transformation is no easy matter, especially when you are experiencing a crisis that challenges the very concepts of time, productivity, and certainty. How do you maintain the energy to move forward in these trying times? Jason Wrobel and Whitney Lauritsen share some of the ways they deal with all the boredom, lethargy, and negativity that comes with this crisis. From reading books and doing TikTok videos to sipping the trendy mushroom coffee or avocado coffee, their tips might just help you gain the energy you need to go through the transformation you want for yourself. Stay tuned to the end to get some of the good vibes Jason and Whitney deliver in the spirit of International Joke Day.
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Transformation Is No Joke: Gaining The Energy To Transform
Jason, do you know what’s been blowing my mind a little bit?
I could guess a litany of things, but they’re probably not correct. Do you want me to try and guess, or do you want to tell me?
Why not? Go ahead and guess.
I have a feeling you’re going to tell me that you discovered a new brand that is the first company to make widely available gluten-free vegan croissants.
Where the heck did that come from?
I don’t know where anything comes from. I pull it from the ethers and it comes through my brain and out my mouth. Is that it?
It’s not. I think you’re revealing what you’re hoping for but that does sound good.
Who wouldn’t want a nice, gluten-free, vegan, buttery croissants? I would take a croissant, but that’s not it. Anyway, I am projecting.
I am sorry, it is not. It’s sad.
You asked me to guess and that was the first thing that came through.
Now that you’re guessing, the thing that’s “blowing” my mind does not sound exciting. I’m blown away that it’s July 1st. People say this a lot. It’s almost becoming a cliche thing and it’s been coming up a lot in 2020 during COVID, especially our relationship with time and how certain months go by fast and other months feel like they’re lasting forever. It’s common to feel like you’ve lost track of time. What day is it? Especially, when you’re working from home, which is something we have each been doing for many years. If anybody is new to working from home or even being a parent for the first time, when your environment changes and your relationship with work or life changes, it can shift your perception of time a lot. June went by incredibly fast.
In fact, I had this sad moment on June 20, 2020, which was an interesting time because there was an eclipse. There was a new moon both on the same day. We went into Mercury retrograde a few days before that. There was a lot of astrological energy going on. Another side note is because of all of those things going on, I was reflecting as I like to do from time to time in different phases of the year. It’s also the summer equinox starting June 21, 2020, and officially becoming summer, which is also the longest day of the year. We have light for the most amount of time. I always look forward to that day, but then simultaneously feel depressed around June 21st because then it’s all downhill from there. We will start losing a light and I remember that I associate that thought and that feeling with being in Europe one year, one summer. I was in my early twenties and the people that I was traveling with mentioned like, “Today’s the longest day of the year.”
I was like, “That’s cool,” but it also feels that we go in this decline. I felt a little sad about that. When time passes quickly, that can also feel a little bit sad. It’s a reminder for me to be more present and appreciate every moment, every hour, and every day that we have. That grounds me and helps me feel like time isn’t slipping away. Time, in general, has been something that I’ve been experiencing all different relationships with. I got regimented with my time, putting things on my calendar, and using my to-do list every day. For the readers, I cannot recommend enough this wonderful platform called TickTick. If you’re brand new to our show, welcome. Even if you are longtime readers of ours, which we’re grateful for, we encourage whoever you are to go to our website, which is Wellevatr.com. Every single episode has show notes, which is a transcript and a resource section. You can read the episodes and you can find links to everything we mentioned.
I love the system of organizing my days. I go through lots of different phases throughout each year and sometimes, I’m in a phase where I’m planning out every day, minute by minute. Sometimes that can feel stressful, but it helps me accomplish a lot, stay organized, and balanced. It simultaneously makes the days feel like a lot’s happening. They’re more rewarding and satisfying, but it’s also amazing to see how quickly time goes by, especially when I’m monitoring my time. What I’ve been doing is I put all of these different tasks into this TickTick program. One of the things I love about that program is you can organize it by priority. I set my priorities for each day based on what I want to accomplish, what I want to feel, and what I need to get done for whatever business-related thing it is.
I’ll also add in rewarding feel-good things such as moving my body. I put my exercise routine on the calendar as a side note which has helped me during this time of COVID, where I haven’t been going to work out classes in person, although that’s about to change. I am going to my first in-person yoga class so we could talk about that. I’ve been working out from home for months so if I put it on my calendar, I am more disciplined about working out at home and watching a video. I’m bringing all of this up because of the relationship to time. It feels like time is flying by. I also feel like the second half of the year tends to go by faster than the first half. Were you with me on that, Jason?
It depends on a variety of factors.
I love your honesty with that. You considered that question and I appreciate that. You’re like, “I don’t agree with you.”
I think that 2020 in general has been a clusterfuck. That doesn’t necessarily mean it’s a bad thing because it’s shaking up a lot of old paradigms, old systems, hierarchies and ways of being. It left a lot of people looking like the shrug emoji, which is how I feel 82.7% of the time throwing my hands up.
For the readers, we don’t complete our show notes. We review them, but when you go to our website and you look at the show notes for each episode, those were created by somebody else on our team and they pick all these stock images. I’m imagining a guy shrugging his shoulders like, “What are you going to do?”
That’s accurate, “What are you going to do?” is the sentiment 82.7% of the time.
What if instead of a stock image, we submit an image of you shrugging? I bet you I have one somewhere. I wish I could search my photos with the keyword shrug and find a picture of you going, “What are you going to do?”
Over the years, I’m sure there is one. It’s just finding it. It might be easier for me to do one and send it in.
Let’s do it. I’m going to put that on our to-do list for you to take a picture of yourself, shrugging for these shows. Maybe that’ll encourage the readers to go to our show notes, to see a picture of Jason shrugging.
I can’t think of anything more compelling than that. Do you want to see a picture of me shrugging in the show notes? You got to run to the computer. Time is interesting because first of all, there’s this idea that time is a human-created concept, which I believe is because animals, trees, insects, nature, amoebas, protozoa, and bacteria are not worried about their 4:00 PM Zoom call. It’s a nonexistent concept. Time, or rather the measurement thereof and the structure we’ve created goes way back to sundials, using the positions of the sun and ancient Egypt and ancient Aztecs. A lot of ancient cultures use different methods to measure time. We have numerical systems to measure time and a lot of debate over daylight savings time, whether or not that should be done with, but it’s clear to me that time is a relative concept and it’s human-created.
When people say time is real, it’s only real because we’ve agreed on it. It’s a collective myth that we agree upon. It doesn’t exist in nature. The interesting thing to me is I remember in high school learning about Einstein’s Theory of Relativity and the relationship between time and space. To paraphrase one thing that always stuck with me about Albert Einstein said, “The perception of time is a relative thing.” If you’re spending time with a beautiful stranger, having a conversation at a coffee shop because you’re engaged in a way and focused your energy in a certain way, times seems to speed up. The good moments the times when you’re engaged, the joyful times on a trip with a lover on vacation, doing something you love seems to zoom by, but if you’re at a job you dislike and you’re constantly looking at the clock, it seems like an hour feels like days. His whole idea was that your engagement and the quantum effect of the observer and the observer’s relationship to the time changes how we perceive the way that time is speeding up or slowing down, which is fascinating.
It reminds me of the realization I had. I have this vivid memory of being a preteen. My parents had invited over a bunch of their friends for summertime. My parents were having some outdoor party and they invited over some people that had kids my age. I remember distinctly exactly where I was in my backyard. It was me being a kid at that time with a couple of kids. We were talking to each other about how time flies when you’re having fun. It was this sweet memory of trying to understand the relationship to time. As you evolve and mature as a person, that changes so much. Here we were, talking about this again like twelve years old or whatever. We determined that the best way for time to slow down was for us to pretend that we weren’t having fun. We were like, “If time flies when you’re having fun, then maybe we can slow time down by not having fun and being bored.” It was such a sweet little innocent moment in my life.
It’s funny that you were trying to do a quantum experiment at that age. “Let’s intentionally force ourselves to not have a good time so that this shit slows down.” You were directly trying to apply the quantum effect that Einstein was talking about, which is hilarious to me.
Have you ever tried to do that? You must have had that thought early on at some point and been frustrated. The other thing I think about is all the sweet moments in life where you look back and you’re like, “If only I knew how good I had it. I can’t believe I’m X age. Where did the time go?” I think about that too with my grandfather who passed away, but he lived until he was 97.5. He would often talk about how time went by quickly. Yet, it was also interesting in his last few years of life, but he wasn’t doing anything.
I often wondered what time felt like for him at that point, when you have less going on in your life. It’s interesting too, as children, we do have a lot going on, but we are acutely aware of boredom. It also came up a lot in conversations about COVID. Relationships to time changed so much. A lot of people were like, “I’m bored,” because things were not the same as they used to be. You couldn’t socialize. A lot of the things that brought us joy were on pause. Suddenly we’re reminded of what it was like to be a kid and get bored, even though there was so much to do.
Boredom is an interesting thing because I have a reaction when people tell me that they’re bored. I’m trying to get to the bottom of this reaction when people have told me they’re bored. One side of it is, as you brilliantly detailed the situation we’re in with quarantine and COVID, there’s been a massive uptick in cases in Arizona, Texas, California and Florida. There’s this talk of a second wave and “normalcy” has not returned in any regard, to be honest. There’s an attempt at normalcy, but my perception is people are still in the house. I noticed that I have a reaction to boredom in the sense of, “You’re bored, then read, journal, sketch and go buy a guitar. Do something creative and productive with your life instead of sitting there.”
I was talking to our friend Adam about it. He was like, “Maybe you don’t appreciate downtime as much.” I was like, “I probably don’t appreciate downtime. I still have some workaholic tendencies perhaps or maybe pushing myself too hard, which I’ve been aware of for years.” I think the word boredom, it’s almost getting in a parental mindset where I’m like, “Why are you bored? There are a million things you could do right now.” Maybe by virtue of the fact that I like to fill my days with a lot of creativity from doing this show and getting it out to more people. I’ve been writing a lot of lyrics for new songs, looking at buying a new guitar, doing more collaborative things. My long answer is when I hear people say they’re bored. I’m like, “There are a billion things you could be putting your energy toward. Why are you bored?”
I’ve had those reactions too, but I notice myself sometimes when I feel bored and part of my wellbeing practice is to grow personal awareness. When I have that thought, I reflect on what that means. Often through the process of reflecting, I realized what the root of it is. Sometimes, it is my wanting to distraction. I’m especially aware of my desire to use my phone, watch TV or a movie, which I do all those things almost every single day. I’ve been spending less time watching TV. There are phases of watching a lot during the beginning parts of COVID and quarantine. I was also using my Nintendo Switch a lot and playing Animal Crossing every single day and I haven’t played that in weeks.Time can slip away quickly. It is a constant reminder for us to be more present and appreciate every moment. Click To Tweet
I feel guilty in a way that I haven’t played because the cool thing about Animal Crossing is it’s a little world. You’re taking care of your avatar. You have a house in this whole community and you get emotionally attached to it. I think the reason Animal Crossing exploded in popularity is two things. We talked about this briefly in our episode with Chris Guillebeau. This is a little throwback because when we interviewed him, I was starting to get into Animal Crossing. It shows my evolution, but what I found interesting about that game was that it did hit at a perfect time when people were feeling bored and they were looking for meaning. They were looking for connection and community. They were looking for something to do that they could achieve something. All of that is triggered in your brain when you use Animal Crossing, plus it brings up a lot of nostalgia like a sweet, innocent thing to do.
Unlike a lot of video games, Animal Crossing has no violence or cruelty. There’s no bad guy that you’re trying to beat and you’re not trying to race time. You are there living life in a peaceful way. You can put yourself in a live vicariously through these characters. It is interesting though being in a place where I don’t feel the desire to play Animal Crossing. They don’t feel as much of a desire to be on my phone. I used to spend a lot of time on TikTok. I go on TikTok for 5 to 10 minutes a day. There were periods where I would go on TikTok for hours. That’s what I did when I was bored.
Sometimes, I would find myself feeling bored that I would try to watch TikTok and simultaneously play Animal Crossing, which I would catch myself and like, “That was ridiculous,” but I think this happens with a lot of people. I also simultaneously still have the desire to watch TV and try to watch TikTok at the same time. For anybody who has used TikTok, that’s virtually impossible because both are video-based and audio-based. You’re trying to split your attention between two similar mediums at the same time. When I would find that desire coming up for myself, I would realize my brain was wanting or craving so much distraction and entertainment.
Sometimes, I would feel bored watching TV because it felt like it was moving slow. The appeal of TikTok is that it goes quickly. You don’t even have a chance to feel bored by it. It’s this instant gratification. You can get lost in that. It becomes addictive because it’s hitting that part of your brain that’s craving for entertainment, “Feed me stimulating things. Increase my dopamine. Make me laugh,” and all of that. It certainly is fascinating the more that you pay attention to your tendencies, your desires, and your relationship with time. For me, when I structure my day in the way that I’ve been talking about, it helps me feel less bored. It helps me avoid being distracted for distracted sake.
To your point, Jason, and I love that Adam said this. Adam was a guest in a previous episode as well. He has so much wisdom to share. It is important for us to take downtime. It’s crucial to our wellbeing. We need to rest. We need to take breaks. We need to have that joy in our life. I think a lot of us are conditioned into this productivity mode, always being on the hustle, always getting things done, and don’t lack off. A lot of that is rooted in history and the way that we’ve been trained through our school systems and the work structure in certain countries. We have to unravel that and ask ourselves, “Why do we have that desire?”
I certainly have found that it’s not necessary. I am in this mode of massive productivity in my life, but I’m still able to step back and tune into myself. Oftentimes, I end up not doing half the things I put on my to-do list for the day simply because I’m allowing myself to be aware of my priorities. That helps me a lot. It’s like I have my set priorities. The top things that I try to do towards the beginning of the day and then a bunch of things that I would like to do. Since they’re not priorities, I can bump them to the next day or a different day entirely and then work through any feelings of guilt that come up for me.
One of the biggest challenges I’ve been facing is not decoding this workaholism tendency that I’ve noticed and getting the root of where it comes from. I have an awareness of the Catholic guilt from my religious upbringing mixed with growing up with a hard-working blue-collar family, which we’ve talked about in previous episodes, referencing my grandfather, work ethic, and a lot of the business and success coaches talking about hard work and the meaning of hard work. The thing that I’ve been struggling with that is layered on top of that is being productive during this COVID period and this time of massive societal upheaval and change.
I feel like for the first time, I don’t have a plan in two decades and on June 20, 2020, it was the anniversary of me graduating college in Columbia. I’ve been in this reflective mood because it’s been decades since I graduated with my Bachelor’s degree and reviewing what I’ve done with my life over the past years, which has been a lot. I have to give myself some credit, which is something I still struggle with and being kind to myself in terms of acknowledging my achievements, my efforts, and the lessons. I’ve been stuck in a mode for so long of, “What’s the next thing?” and always having a plan.
For years, for better or for worse, I’ve had some semblance of clarity of where my efforts or at least where I thought they were leading to in terms of a professional sense or a business sense. We laughed about throwing the hands up in the shrug emoji. To be honest, it’s also indicative of the fact that I can’t project what I want to have happened, what I’m planning on having happened, where I want to be living, or what I want to be doing? It’s unsettling and extremely uncomfortable to admit that I don’t have a plan for the first time and it’s something that brings me anxiety. I feel a lot of balance because I’m used to operating in that way. I’m used to different degrees of overworking myself like, “I’ve got to know where this is leading. I’ve got to know what the next step is. Where is this heading?”
I don’t feel like I have any of that now. It hasn’t dissuaded me from keeping my creative juices flowing. I find it unsettling with because I don’t know where all of this is heading. Maybe I never did. Maybe I was in this illusion and addiction to a certainty that I convinced myself that, “You go in and get this degree from college. You go get this job. You sing in this band and do this stuff musically. You audition here and you start your business there and go to culinary school.” I don’t need to rehash the last years of my life, nor do I want to, but in some way, maybe I convinced myself there was an illusion of certainty that all of these things are going to add up to this result. Maybe for the first time, I’m admitting that there was a certainty there. There’s no guarantee that our efforts, hard work, creativity, and our collaborations are going to result in anything.
I’m sure a lot of people can relate to that. At this present moment, I’m in a different relationship with myself. When I said the phrase, “At this point in my life,” I mean I haven’t experienced much of those thoughts. I think it’s because I have been spending so much time learning and diving deep into what it means to be well, to take care of myself, and to have self-acceptance. I’ve read a lot of books about this. Those are part of my methods of processing, understanding myself working through these tough emotions. Through the daily practice of reading, reflecting, and journaling, I’ve increased my journaling practice and that’s massively helped.
For you, Jason, and for anyone who’s relating to that, one of the most helpful things that I’ve read, there are two books. One is The Self-Acceptance Project, which is fantastic. I could have highlighted every word in that book. Part of the way I read is I highlight phrases, that way I can come back to them and find words of wisdom when I need them. I highlighted over 300 phrases in that book. I know because I do it digitally and it’s all synced through Kindle. I feel like you would love that book. If you’re curious about that book, I highly recommended it. The other one that I’ve been finishing up, I’m only 30% to 40% through it. I’ve been thinking of you a lot as I’ve been reading it. It’s about being perfect. I love that book because it’s also a lot about self-acceptance, but it’s examining our relationships. The title of the book is The Pursuit of Perfect: How to Stop Chasing Perfection and Start Living a Richer, Happier Life. It’s wonderfully written and the author has another great book called Happier that I read. That led me to this perfect book.
What I like about it is he pulls from spiritual perspectives, ancient wisdom, and scientific research. He’s compiling a lot of great perspectives and advice. He helps you unravel your relationship with perfection. He also shares the difference between being a perfectionist and something that he calls optimalist. Instead of optimistic, you’re optimizing your life versus trying to make it perfect. It’s well-written. I couldn’t recommend it enough. I feel that it would be helpful for you because it might be a bit of a reframe for you to examine all of these things. As I said, with self-awareness, it’s more about not trying to fix yourself, but trying to understand it and perhaps, reframe it a little so you have a better relationship with how you’re feeling. It sounds to me like you’re experiencing some pain from this. It’s been tough for you, Jason, and you’ve shared in other episodes that you often feel like you’re going through a bit of an identity crisis or something. Maybe it would be uplifting to read a book like that.
I’m open to receiving new perspectives, tools and ways of framing this. If I look at the artists and the people, the contemporary figures that I admire, there’s a thread through I’ve noticed. There’s a chameleonic aspect to their arc, not career-wise, but as people. I brought up David Bowie before and he’s a wonderful example because he was a person who started off in the late ‘60s as this acoustic troubadour. His early albums were acoustic folk. He became Ziggy Stardust and The Thin White Duke and became a global pop icon in the ‘80s. He got into darker electronica with Trent Reznor. His final album that came out right around the time that he died in 2016 was unbelievable. When you look at the arc of his career as an artist and a person from the fashion to the branding, to his messaging, to his lyrics, here’s an example of someone I deeply admire.
He maybe was afraid, but he trusted his instincts and kept moving in directions that perhaps people wouldn’t understand or accept. He wasn’t one of those artists that found a hit-making formula and stuck with the same thing. Sometimes writers, musicians or fine artists will come up with a style, a hook or something that they’re known for in Hollywood. They call it typecasting and the people that I admire from artists to entrepreneurs, I could name a lot of them. There’s been a chameleon aspect and for me, the reticence or the fear that I feel in my own personal evolution is facing the unknown, not knowing what’s coming on the other side of the caterpillar being in the chrysalis and turning into a butterfly.
On that note, as I wrap up this tangential ramp about my personal evolution and not knowing where it’s adding, I was watching Dr. Michael Bernard Beckwith. He was talking about this process of how everyone uses this analogy of the caterpillar turning into the butterfly. This I did not know though when they are in the chrysalis stage, which is the embodied stage of when the changeover is happening. There are things called imaginal cells inside the chrysalis, which are the new cells that are being created that eventually transform it into a butterfly, but the immune system of the caterpillar is creating white blood cells and defense mechanisms to kill off the imaginal cells. There’s a battle that goes on within this creature that’s half-caterpillar and half-butterfly. It’s a limbo state and it’s only when the process flips over to becoming more of a butterfly and completing that evolutionary transformational process. When the imaginal cells duplicate faster than the caterpillar’s immune defense mechanisms and overpower the immune system of the caterpillar, therefore becoming a butterfly.
I thought that was fascinating. To me, it reflects my inner resistance like there’s some psychological defense mechanism of like, “You’re going into uncharted territory. What are you becoming? You don’t even have a title for you. What are you even doing? You’re not that old thing anymore, but you don’t know what the new thing is. What the fuck is happening?” Metaphorically, I feel like the imaginal cells, the creative juices within me are battling the psychological immunity. That’s like, “You’re that old thing. You’re a chef, a speaker, an author, and you’re all this old shit you’ve known for years,” but the imaginal cells that are being born within me are like, “We’re going to overpower you.” I’ve been in this struggle that is an analogy to the process of the caterpillar becoming the butterfly.
That is fascinating and well-articulated, no surprise. I love that. I’m grateful that you’re expressing this because there’s got to be somebody reading who can relate and maybe feels alone. I would assume based on the way you talk about it that you often feel alone with these feelings. Is that accurate, Jason?
I do. I struggle with it. There’s the egoic part of identifying with the thing that I’ve been doing so long that I’m afraid of letting it go, even though I want to let go of it because of the accolades, the attention, the celebration, and people knowing me for this thing. There’s also the idea of letting people down like, “They want a certain content for me. They want certain creativity,” but whatever’s being born in me, I don’t have a name for it. I don’t know where it’s going to end up, but I’m definitely in that limbo state of the imaginal cells battling the part of my psyche and my ego that wants me to stay stuck in the old story. I think being in that battle does feel lonely sometimes.
I think it’s also what I’ve noticed with myself, with you and hearing other people, especially during this time of COVID. It’s draining and emotionally exhausting. A lot of us don’t account for, and maybe put a lot of pressure on ourselves, judgment, guilt, or shame around is not having the energy to accomplish as much as we want to. I feel like I’m coming out on the other side of things in some ways, but I also know it’s temporary. That’s how I’m feeling now. For a large part of COVID, for me, that was the period of mid-March through early to mid-June, 2020, it felt emotionally heavy. A lot of people were expressing that and they were wanting to sleep more, but feeling a lot of shame. It’s like, “I don’t want to sleep this much because I want to get a lot done.”
Part of what you’re describing, another element of this, Jason, is it’s exhausting to transform. If you go to this metaphor of the caterpillar turning into a butterfly, the amount of work that it takes to do that transformation has got to be exhausting. I don’t know for sure, but when that caterpillar in the cocoon, it is resting and evolving. It is like when we’re teenagers and we’re going through growth spurts, we often need more sleep. I imagine the caterpillar is doing a lot of sleeping before it transforms into a butterfly. For you, Jason, I know that you’ve been struggling with low energy. That’s something you certainly verbalize to me. Has that been a COVID-related thing? Is that partially that there’s a lot of processing going on and it’s draining for you?
It’s when I’m exercising a lot of mental energy, analytical energy, trying to figure things out in my life instead of letting life happen, which I’m getting better at all the time. I’m still practicing, allowing and letting life happen and not being fixated on trying to plan things and predict things. The exertion of psychic intellectual and analytical energy on a mental level is draining for me. As sensitive as an emotional person as I am, I also feel like I’m analytical and get stuck in my head a lot. I do get stuck in my head and this period of COVID has been pushing buttons in me that has been like, but, “You’ve got to have a plan. You’ve got to have a backup plan. What if you have to leave LA? What if you have to throw the animals in the car and leave, what are you going to do? Where are you going to put your stuff? Should you stay here? Are you going to get unemployment?”Downtime is crucial to wellbeing. Click To Tweet
It seems like I have been gnashing, thrashing, and throwing a fit mentally a lot during this period because the part of me that wants to control, to be predictable, who wants a five-year plan, to be proactive, and try and predict any ways that this could derail my life. It’s all gone to shit. On a spiritual level, if you want to say this whole period, for me and the conversations that not only we have had, but a lot of my close friends and colleagues have expressed a similar sentiment, which is, “We have no idea what the hell is going to happen.”
Maybe this is life’s way of not only slowing us down for the Earth to get a nice reset, which it has, but it’s showing us that, “All those illusions you had of trying to predict and control life and expecting what you think is going to happen, it’s all bullshit.” To be honest, I’m finally realizing life is calling me on my own bullshit. I’m like, “Life you’re right. I have been trying to exert way too much control, predictability, and certainty and none of that exists.” In a way, perhaps all of this language we’ve been hearing, not just from people like Eckhart Tolle, but going back to a lot of ancient, spiritual attacks that being in the present moment and not being in the future or the past, that’s all there is. That is a message that I keep getting hammered into me over and over again is, “That’s all you’ve got. Anything else is a total illusion.”
I imagine many people can relate to this. I often look into trends and what people are searching for online. If this is your first time reading or if you haven’t read some of our episodes, one new thing that we’re going to do or experiment with, at least for the time being is to share some of the funny, interesting, and provocative things that people search for online. We’ll be doing that at the end of this episode. I was planning on doing that towards the beginning of this episode. We went in a different direction. It is an international joke day and I had some things planned, but then it took this serious turn. I’m going to save all the joke stuff I was planning for the end. I encourage the readers to hold out for the end of this because we’ve got some juicy things coming.
One thing that I want to bring up and that’s been an interesting trend. It makes me feel like a lot of people are struggling with this energy balance. Let’s be honest, this is an ongoing thing. One of the big human struggles is maintaining our energy. Part of it is because of this hustle culture. We’re conditioned in a lot of ways to work ourselves to the bone and we’re not usually encouraged to sleep. As the awareness around health and wellness increases, we’re starting to learn that we need more rest and we need more quality sleep, but we’re still clinging onto these old ideas of hustling. “I’ll sleep when I’m dead” type of mentality.
A couple of things that I found interesting and trending is one person has been interested in mushroom coffee. When I saw that, I was excited and I wanted to integrate that into an episode. This feels like a good time because we are both passionate about mushroom powders. That would be things with reishi, chaga, and lion’s mane. They’re all these powerful mushrooms that have tons of nutritional benefits. I’m sure we’ve talked about this in other episodes, but it is important to reiterate in this context the combination of mushroom powders with coffee and specifically organic high-quality coffee is magical. One of our favorite brands is Four Sigmatic. If you haven’t tried them yet, they’re one of my favorite wellness products out there.
I feel like we had some shared history with Four Sigmatic. I don’t know if I got into them through you or around the same time. I don’t have a massive recollection of when I was introduced to Four Sigmatic, but I feel like it was with you at the Natural Products Expo or Longevity. They’ve been exhibitors at some of these events and trade shows that we’ve been to. I know that we have spent a lot of time trying their products together. Four Sigmatic were known in the beginning for their coffee powders, but they have a wide variety of things. They have matcha blends. They have also mushroom powders without any caffeine. It’s interesting because all their products are rooted in nutritional energy.
It’s also an exciting thing because we are taking what is ancient and true in terms of the Chinese herbal medicine, the Ayurvedic herbal medicine, and having more modern interpretations and uses for these things that have been used for hundreds or in some cases, thousands of years. That’s exciting to me is the blending of the ancient wisdom with the modern applications of it. On this point, I want to make a declaration. It is important that instead of people blindly experimenting with these super herbs. I call them super herbs because they’re extremely potent, especially if you get a 10:1, 15:1, 20:1 concentration, which is a highly potent herb, they do different things in the body. You mentioned reishi, chaga, lion’s mane, shiitake, Cordyceps, all these things. They all have different functional benefits.
For anyone who’s not familiar with my work, as a chef, a nutrition educator, I’m big into functional medicine and understanding what a particular food is going to do for your mind, body, and spirit. Since we’re talking about energy, I wanted to throw this in here some bonus tips. Out of all the super mushrooms that are out there for energy, I love cordyceps. They are also known as the silkworm mushroom. They’re long and skinny mushrooms. You can get them whole. Dragon Herbs’ Ron Teeguarden sells them. You can get the whole cordyceps mushroom. I prefer powder. I found that I get a ton of energy if I take it in a blend. Another one of our favorite brands that we love is Om Mushrooms. They have some energy blends that we love with cordyceps mushrooms and some of these other super mushrooms. Since we’re talking about energy and maintaining energy, I think at the top of my list would be a high-quality cordyceps.
I bring this up because there’s this dan tian, a feeling of lethargic, which is something you brought up. Let’s say that you take one of these products. We love Four Sigmatic and Om. I went on the Four Sigmatic webpage and they’re having a big sale, but I don’t know if it’ll be going when you’re in this episode. Be sure to check in because we’ll keep you posted on those things. I’m curious for you, Jason, because I’ve experienced this where I can load up on coffee, mushroom powders, tea, matcha, whatever it is, and no matter how much of those stimulating ingredients that I put in my body, whether it’s caffeine.
The cool thing about mushrooms, in case we haven’t made it clear, is that mushrooms on their own can be energizing as a number of different foods. Also, water, simply drinking water can give you more energy. It depends on whether it’s a nutritional depletion, sleep, or lack of hydration. There’s a lot of things that can contribute, but sometimes, it’s an energetic depletion. Sometimes you simply need rest and you need to rest your mind. These products won’t help even when you’re taking a lot of them. How have you been managing your energy and have products like this helped you? Are there times where they’re not making a difference because there’s something deeper at play with your lethargy?
I think there are a lot of ways to address this. I have noticed that when I’m getting consistent high-quality deep sleep, my energy levels are greatly impacted by that. Beyond that, if we’re talking about products, it’s important to find things that resonate with your body as an individual. As an example, we love coffee. We love the way coffee tastes, but you also love the way that coffee feels in your body. You’re not treating it as a way to mask a deeper level of depletion or lethargy. You’re not like, “I got to have my coffee,” and you’re not addressing your sleep. You’re a person who has a holistic approach to your wellbeing. For me though, I’ve noticed over the years, especially writing my first book, Eaternity, which I was drinking a lot of Bulletproof coffee at the time and some other stimulants that were being used for those late-night writing sessions, but I found that I don’t feel great on coffee.
I’ll drink it a little bit from time to time, but my adrenals and my endocrine system are extremely sensitive to coffee. If I drink coffee on even a semi-consistent basis, I feel cracked out, jittery anxious, and I have negative thoughts. If I have, it’s almost like having a little bit of whiskey or a tiny bit of wine. It’s like a sensorial pleasure, but I don’t use coffee as an energy booster or a cognition booster. I’ve noticed that a combination of medicinal mushrooms, cacao and matcha feel good in my body. That L-Theanine, the amino acid that’s primary in matcha, I find great for my mental and brain function, my cognition and retention. My brain vibes with matcha, raw cacao, and a combination of these medicinal mushrooms.
That’s my body though. To your point, I don’t treat it as an attempt to overcome a sleep deficit. I don’t try and use it to mask things that might be going on a deeper level. However, when we have back to back episodes or I have a few Zoom meetings in a row and I got to power through my day, I’m not going to cancel episodes unless it’s something that I am fully depleted and need to crash. I’m not going to cancel things so I’ll use that matcha, cacao, and mushroom combination to be like, “I have an hour until recording or an hour until a business call. I need to power through,” but I’m careful not to rely on those things to make up for deeper adrenal or a deeper sleep deficit issue because those things become a crutch. That’s a dangerous place to be when we’re using even healthy substances as a crutch to try and overcome a deeper issue.
That’s well said. It’s interesting our relationships with coffee because we were talking before about distractions. Sometimes, we’re trying to put a Band-Aid on something versus addressing the root problem. That’s one of the reasons mushroom coffee is growing in popularity is it’s combining two things. That’s one of the reasons that we’ve loved brands like Om which stands for Organic Mushroom. One of the cool things about them is they make mainly, if not entirely, caffeine-free products. Maybe it is not coffee, but maybe they use like yerba mate. Are they dependent on the mushrooms as the stimulant?
I haven’t checked their formula. They sometimes tweak their formulas. I believe they had an energy product that had guarana in it, which is a South American berry that does have caffeine. It is similar to the coffee berry. I don’t know what the caffeine comparison would be between a coffee bean and the guarana berry, but it is that pantheon of a natural source of caffeine. That energizer product works. I have used it for years off and on as a pre-workout energizer before I hit the gym or go to yoga. That shit is potent.
Another cool thing since we’re on the subject of coffee, and our friend, Melissa, shared this with me, which I want to try this. There’s a company out there called Avocajoe. It’s the world’s first bottled avocado coffee. It’s a plant-based version of Bulletproof coffee. When Jason said that he had Bulletproof coffee, a lot of people associate Bulletproof coffee with coffee and added butter. That was the generic term, but there’s also the Bulletproof brand. You technically can still have that Bulletproof coffee trend and add things like coconut oil, MCT oil, or even vegan butter into it. People often were using ghee or dairy-based butter, but there are ways to veganize it. I’m curious about Avocajoe because it’s a take on Bulletproof coffee using avocado as the fat. They did a Kickstarter or they’re in the middle. I think they’re wrapping it up. I’m certainly want to get in touch with them. If I do, I could share. I don’t know if Jason would try it. You’d probably try it. You’re not completely opposed to coffee, Jason.
I enjoy it with Michael, my mentor. We have a special bottle of 50-year aged Japanese whiskey that on special occasions, we’ll do a shot together. I’m into the tactile sensation, tasting things and making sure my palette stays active and alert. I love the taste of coffee, but in high concentrations, I don’t like how it makes my body feel.
I’m grateful for that because I love experiencing new things with other people, like Jason. Hopefully, I will get my hands on some Avocajoe and maybe we can do a taste test in an episode.
If mukbang is a thing on video, maybe we will do a podbang, a show taste test. Let’s do that.
Hopefully, we’ll get back to doing videos. We’ve done a lot of our episodes before quarantine on camera. We were uploading them to our Patreon as a perk. If you didn’t know this yet, you can support us financially on Patreon. For a few dollars, you can get access to things like videos. One thing I want to do soon starts doing virtual videos because we don’t record in person as we used to and that might change. Although, I would say our setups are nice and it’s convenient not to have to travel somewhere to record. We go to our home office spaces, but certainly with guests, it’d be nice to have a video with them again. It adds a level of connection that I’ve been missing. We could do that mukbang. It could also be an ASMR, the sound of somebody drinking something, but not everybody’s into ASMR. You might get turned off if you hear us drinking coffee and all the little sounds that come along with it.
This is a reminder too that we want your feedback. We do get a lot of positive feedback on Instagram, which I’m super grateful for. You can find us @Wellevatr. Every once in awhile, someone will send us a message. We got one earlier and that’s sweet. I’m grateful for it, but I also would love to hear specific feedback, whether it’s constructive criticism or a suggestion, things that you want to know more. Please don’t hesitate to reach out to us via direct message on social media or through email, our email is [email protected]. You can go to the show notes that I’ve mentioned a few times. There’s a comment section there. Comment and let us know. What do you think of ASMR? Do you want to see us do more videos? Do you like coffee? Can you relate to how Jason’s been feeling? We would love to chat with you. As we start to wrap up the episode, Jason, why should we dive into the fun stuff that I had planned? Unless you have anything else to say.
This is semi-serious, but if you are a person who follows the show and wants to comment, please don’t spam us with MLM offers. We get those comments on our website sometime of, “Have you guys heard of CBD?” I go in and delete them. I always laugh whenever we get anonymous pitches from people that are like, “We did a whole episode on CBD and marijuana,” and they’re like, “Have you heard of CBD? There are all these advantages.” This is a tangential side note, but if someone doesn’t take the time to research who we are, what we’re talking about, what we’re passionate about, or what our previous episodes were and then we get a pitch about that thing we talked about, I’m always like, “Bye.” With all due respect, if you, the reader, any colleagues, brands, or anyone wants to work with us or collab, I’m encouraging you to do your research first so that when you pitch us, it lands.Sometimes you just need to rest your mind. Click To Tweet
It’s part of our integrity as content creators and influencers to believe in what we’re talking about. I was thinking about this because I get pitched every single day to new products.
Especially that we’ve been in the game for quite some time. Since the show has started to gain more momentum, thank you, readers, for your love, the number of pitches has increased the more the show gets out there. I’ve noticed that.
I’m not talking about the show specifically. I’m saying with my brand Eco-Vegan Gal and whatever else I’m doing online every single day, I get pitches. It is interesting because the more I get, the more discerning I am about what I say yes and no to. I’ve also been working on an offering, training for brands to help them understand how to better work with influencers. I was reflecting on how some brands think that if they send you their product for free that you’re going to do all this work for them. That’s not true because we have been in this world for many years as content creators and professionals. Our time is valuable as is your time as readers. All of our time is valuable, but there’s this trend that people thinking, “If I send you this, you’re going to do all this work.” I’m bringing this up because I find that it takes me a lot of time to use a product before I know how much I like it.
In the past, I have sometimes felt rushed to recommend things that I didn’t fully believe in and my opinion would change. When we bring up brands like Four Sigmatic and Om, those are products that we have each been using for many years. We have so much experience with them. We have trust with the company and that allows us to recommend it. To Jason’s point, when you get pitched by someone who thinks that they can send you something to earn your endorsement or pay you to earn your endorsement, it’s a big disservice to you, the readers. That would be out of integrity. To piggyback on what Jason’s saying, if you’re hoping you can pitch us on something, we take a lot of time to reflect on it.
The same thing goes with our guests. We get a lot of guests’ pitches and we’ve had to create this new system to address them. The people we bring on our show, there are 1 or 2 instances where we interviewed someone we didn’t know super well. That was through a recommendation of somebody else. Everybody else on the show is someone that we have known for a decent amount of time. In fact, most of our guests, we’ve known for a minimum of five years, but a lot of them average closer to ten years. We want to bring on people we align with and we take our relationship with you seriously. We never want to recommend somebody or share something that doesn’t feel like it’s an alignment with us unless it is to prove the point of getting out of your comfort zone. That’s a different story, or in the case of trying a new product. Maybe we’ll try something new and share our immediate impressions of it. That’s a long way of going into this. With no further ado, Jason, we should jump into the fun segment that I’ve been teasing. It’s a nice little note to wrap up on.
The new thing that we would love your feedback on and we’re experimenting with is ending each episode by going into keyword trends or analytic queries. We did a whole episode on this. We talked about Google Analytics and how people find our website. I have a regular practice at least a few times a week. I go and monitor the keywords people are using. I also will look at trends. I talked about mushroom coffee as a trend and maybe avocado coffee is going to be a new trend, but I also like to see what’s happening in the world. With being an international joke day, I thought it would be interesting to look at some of the joke-related terms people have used for us. I found some interesting things. As a trend, I’m curious, what your definition of this word will be before I tell you what the actual definition is. I saw this trend on the internet called copypasta. If you had to guess, what do you think it means?
People are 3D printing pasta now. That’s my first guess and only guess.
I’m second-guessing at myself and like, “Is this a real thing? What is that?” Copypasta is defined by Wikipedia as a block of text that is copied and pasted across the internet. You could think of it as copypaste-a so people will paste the same phrase over and over again in things like online forums and social networking websites. It’s basically spam. I’ve been seeing this on TikTok and maybe that would explain it. There’s this trend. TikTok skewing a lot of younger kids. I’m sure this is something they do to entertain themselves, which is to take a phrase and paste it in the comment section of videos, even if it has nothing to do with that video. It’s an amusement. That would certainly fall into international joke day like, “This will be funny. I’m going to play a prank on somebody by pasting obnoxious things.” Hopefully, no one does that on our show notes because that would certainly get annoying.
If you’re going to do it, they have to make sure it’s creative and interesting like an unrelated tangential thing like, “Them hedgehogs’ balls aren’t spikey enough,” and my mind goes, “Do hedgehogs have spikes on their balls too?”
If somebody pasted that phrase 100 times, you would get pissed off about it, wouldn’t you?
Unless they simplified it. If they got creative with it, but probably by the 100th time, I’d be annoyed.
You’re welcome to do that, but I feel like our readers are not the type to do those things, but maybe we’re permitting them to experiment a little. That reminds me of the benefits of jokes for our wellbeing is that laughter is great medicine. Going back to what I was saying at the beginning of this episode, how time flies when you’re having fun. If you are feeling bored, jokes are a fun way to spend your time. That perhaps explains the popularity and draws a platform like TikTok because it’s generally funny and people are creative on there. They have these funny jokes. You get in on things and there are memes on platforms like TikTok. The more you use the platform, the more you get them, and thus, you feel like you’re on the inside.
That brings us altogether too, which is also helpful for our well being. That feeling of community like, “We’re bonded because we’re all laughing about the same thing.” It’s also interesting on platforms that some of the funniest things are people doing human things that we can all relate to. It’s funny because it’s a true type of thing and it’s relatable. If you see somebody trip and fall, that’s always funny. We talked about this in our episode about pranks. That drew some people to our website as well and brought up some of these search queries that I’m going to bring up. I think comedy in general, we talked about this in the previous episode, the power of comedy and Jason’s background as a comedian and missing going to watch comedians in person. Jason, this might be a good time for you to plug some of your favorite comedian videos. I know you were talking about Dave Chappelle had a good stand-up routine or something.
David LaChapelle was the music video director. Dave Chappelle, I would say it’s much more of a direct and scathing social commentary than stand-up special. Netflix released 8:46 where Dave Chappelle is talking about George Floyd. He’s talking about racial profiling and racism. He sprinkled some comedy in there, but it was a side of Dave Chappelle I’ve never seen on stage before, which made it all more poignant. I watched that and I have been diving back into my favorite comedian of all time, which is George Carlin. A lot of his comedy from the 1990s and early 2000s was prescient in terms of government control, surveillance, and pharmaceuticals. He was saying some stuff back then that you’re like, “This dude was predicting the future.” I’ve been watching Dave Chappelle and George Carlin.
The woman I’m dating, Laura, has turned me on to Tom Segura. I never watched Tom Segura stuff. He’s funny as hell. During this quarantine period, by virtue of dating someone who’s into stand-up comedy and is a lot more of a student of the game than I am. She’s been turning me on to a lot of people. The other person I’m liking who is very clean, he doesn’t swear or talk about dirty stuff, but he’s hilarious and creative is Mike Birbiglia. That’s a person I never touched upon before either. I am going back to the old Carlin and the Chappelle stuff, which are people I’ve loved for years, but also getting turned on a new comedy. There are my recommendations.
You’re always full of good recommendations. As I’ve promised, I’m going to share with you some of the search queries that brought people to our website and that are related to jokes. I’m going to do it in a format, where I would love you to share what comes to mind related to this. What is a joke that makes you pee your pants?
I’ve never pissed in my pants from a joke ever.
Are you serious? You’ve never peed in your pants because you were laughing so hard. I’m not talking about a lot, just a little.
I have never in my life. I’ve never pissed myself from a joke. I can’t answer that question.
It didn’t make sense because when you laugh, your muscles are tensing so your bladder control might not be as strong so you can’t help but pee a little. You know the phrase, “I laughed so hard that I peed in my pants.”
I’ve never done it before. The stuff that makes me laugh hard is wild, outrageous and out there. I always go back to Robin Williams because his mind was quick, tangential. It’s the way that he would link seemingly disjointed disassociative concepts and make them work together. Someone like Robin Williams, who came out with some outrageous shit. Those are the comedians that I tend to gravitate towards. Maybe something like that, that’s avant-garde, weird and bizarre, but I’ve never pissed myself from laughing.
I feel like you’ve been missing out on life. You haven’t lived if you haven’t peed your pants because you were laughing so hard. You’re thinking about traditional jokes, but for me, when I think of what makes me laugh and also a phrase that I’ve used a lot with my sister and close friends is funny things, my body feels weak. I can’t breathe or I can’t move my body. I feel paralyzed. I don’t have control over myself type of weakness. I was on the phone with my sister for the first time that we’ve had a long conversation in a while. The way that my laugh is it’s a full belly laugh and I can barely get out the words. I’m also thinking back, we have these moments frequently. I have one memory when we were on our road trip to Colorado, which I’m planning on editing that video. Do you remember there was one night in one of the hotel rooms where I was trying to tell you something, but I couldn’t even get the words out of my mouth because I was laughing hard?We may not know what is coming next, but the willingness to try new things and venture into new territory is what moves us forward. Click To Tweet
I have a video of it.
It was funny because I was trying to get you to say something that I knew was going to make me laugh. It was the anticipation of you saying it, that was making me laugh already. I was laughing so hard I couldn’t get the words out so you started to laugh. It was this whole domino effect of laughter and those are some of the greatest joys of all time. It’s not even quite a joke, but it makes you laugh hard and that’s what I associate with laughing so hard and peeing my pants.
I know about losing my breath and laughing so hard and then you start laughing again because it’s funny that you can’t breathe. I know that place, but I’ve never urinated or defecated in my pants from laughter.
I wonder how many people defecate because they’re laughing so hard.
I’m sure it’s more common than we realized. There could be people laughing so hard that they shart themselves. It’s got to be a thing.
Probably is and maybe no one wants to admit it. Certainly not in the search queries. Another interesting one that came up was bodybuilder jokes. I sat from home and I’m like, “Why did somebody search for that and find their website?” It makes sense because we had Robert Cheeke on, who’s a vegan bodybuilder and that’s one of our most popular episodes of all time. One of my favorites because Robert got vulnerable. He shared a lot about things like social media and his anxiety, but that query probably led to our site because we were sharing some inside jokes. If you’re curious and you want an episode that goes from lighthearted to vulnerable and real and honest, I highly recommend that one.
When I saw that search query, I texted Robert and asked if he knew any actual bodybuilder jokes that we could share. He hasn’t gotten back to me yet, but when he does, if he shares a good one. We were referencing Ronnie Coleman as our inside joke. I don’t know if Ronnie himself would count as a joke, but he’s certainly amusing in a sweet way. A couple more, somebody has searched for the phrase, “Did you hear about the chiropractor who?” It’s like the beginning of some punch. There must be some joke about chiropractors. Another one that doesn’t make sense to me. I’m curious if you know what this term means. The search phrase was, “Take Me Out,” jokes. Do you know about this, Jason?
No. I’m still tripping me out on the chiropractor thing. Apparently, there’s a book of chiropractor jokes. Someone wrote a book about chiropractor jokes. The first one that comes up is, “What do you call a chiropractor that loves his job?” A crack addict. There’s another one while I’m on it, “Have you heard of the good-looking chiropractor who fixes neck injuries? She’s a real head-turner.”
It’s funny because I associate chiropractors with middle-aged men. Maybe many of them are dads and they appeal. This Take Me Out joke, the first thing I saw when I looked it up was related to some TV show or something called Take Me Out, which I’m not familiar with. It looks like it was a UK show and then there’s a Reddit thread of, “Can someone take me out?” Does take me out mean, “Take me out to pasture?” It looks like a lot of these, the take me out is the name of some show. It was a British game show. It was presented by a comedian. Maybe people are looking for some of the highlights from that TV show. We get educated on this show as well. Do you have another joke that you would like to share, Jason?
No, my style of stand-up was never like one-liner jokes. It was more of storytelling. We can save that for another episode. We’ll have a whole episode on jokes and stuff.
We did that on our April Fool’s episode.
I want to look up as we close. Do you know any vegan jokes?
No, when I hear that I’m like, “They’re going to be some dumb joke. That’s not going to make me laugh.” I don’t like the cliche stuff. It depends on the context. Sometimes dad jokes can be funny.”
This is ridiculous. “Veganism is like communism. They’re both fine unless you like food.” “Who’s the vegan cousin of Bruce Lee? Broccoli.”
This is making me uncomfortable. We invite you to share with us your input. If you have any good jokes that you would like to share, please tell us. If you have feedback, if you want to chime in on something, if you have questions, if you want to know that you’re not alone and how you’re feeling, please be part of the show notes. There can be a whole community there so the comment section. You can become part of our social media community, which is @Wellevatr on Instagram, Facebook, Twitter, Pinterest, even TikTok. We deal a little bit on there, not as much as we’d like. We’re still trying to figure out what to post on TikTok. Mainly, it’s videos of Jason dancing and being goofy. Maybe that will make you laugh. You can go see what we’ve recorded.
We want to have you part of the conversation. We want you to know how valuable you are. We are grateful for reading through to the end of the episodes. I hope that you got some value here, some things to reflect on, and you laughed a little bit. We will be back with another episode soon. We have an incredible guest coming up per usual so stay tuned. Be sure to subscribe if you haven’t yet and check out the show notes at Wellevatr.com. You’ll find links to videos, books, previous episodes, and products we love like Four Sigmatic and Om. We will be sure to keep you posted on things that we’re trying like Avocajoe, even though we’ve never tried it before, but in good faith, hopefully, it’s good. Jason likes avocados and I like coffee. Fingers crossed, the combination is a wonder.
What could go wrong? Nothing. We are always up for trying new things. We leave you with this, the spirit of experimentation. You may not know where life is leading you. You may not know what the next chapter of your life is, but the willingness to experiment, try new things, and venture into new territory is part of the spirit that moves us forward through life. We are ending on that note, hopefully, it’s profound. We love you. We appreciate you. Thanks for getting uncomfortable with us.
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- International Joke Day
- Staring Down Financial Uncertainty in the Midst of the COVID-19 Pandemic with Chris Guillebeau – Previous episode
- Connecting with Others Through Parenthood, Tea Ceremonies and Being Offline with Adam Yasmin – Previous episode
- The Self-Acceptance Project
- The Pursuit of Perfect: How to Stop Chasing Perfection and Start Living a Richer, Happier Life
- Dr. Michael Bernard Beckwith
- Four Sigmatic
- Natural Products Expo
- The Longevity Now Conference
- Dragon Herbs
- Om Mushrooms
- 8:46 – Netflix Special with Dave Chappelle
- Patreon – Wellevatr
- @Wellevatr – Instagram
- [email protected]
- Handling Social Media Anxiety with Robert Cheeke – Previous episode
- The Pranks We Regret – Previous episode
- Facebook – Wellevatr
- Twitter – Wellevatr
- Pinterest – Wellevatr
- TikTok – Wellevatr
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